Offshore Outsourcing & Scammer

Blog about offshore outsourcing and scammer in the outsourcing industry

A funny chat with a scammer

ScamYesterday I got a friend request on Facebook from a person with the name Dalbaq Singh. Shortly after I accepted the friendship request I got the first chat message from him (the provided time is GMT+1):

10:53pm Dalbaq Singh:

Hey Rudolf !

I came across your profile and your company ! Wanted to know more about the type of process you can help to start ! Waiting for your reply ! Thanks !

A short check of his Facebook profile returned, that the profile is empty, he cannot show his face and he has only one friend - me. I know already which kind of person he is. As I'm not offering anywhere something I replied the same way like to everybody who is asking me for campaigns:

11:04pm Rudolf Faix:

I'm sorry, but i'm already retired. I'm not offering anything. I list only the scammers for not getting bored

He tries to show that he understands it, but he tries to continue:

11:06pm Dalbaq Singh:

Ok !

But do you have any contacts or anybody who could help me with the process !

Ok, let's continue the game:

11:07pm Rudolf Faix:

I have not really some contacts for this. Each campaign needs to get checked for being a scam campaign

He is already losing his patience:

11:08pm Dalbaq Sing:

I have started a new centre and want a process !

Such words are already a big alarm sign for me. As he is thinking that he has the right to get a process even from someone who does not offer any process, I explained him:

11:08pm Rudolf Faix:

Normally you need to search for a process before you start a new center.

The outsourcing industry is already dead.

With the next message he tries to show that he knows more about me, my work and my past then I'm knowing about myself:

11:09pm Dalbaq Singh:

But I hope since you were in this industry you must have some contacts who are already working in this industrry !

I have a process of SEO and website development for a company in UK !

I want to get core BPO process now !

What has a SEO (Search Engine Optimizing) process to do with a call center work? At the time I have been young I liked to have so many things too and I did not get it. Now I'm happy with the things I have. For this reason I replied:

11:11pm Rudolf Faix:

Be happy that you had a SEO process. They are very seldom too

His answer has been surprising me. Search engine optimizing is a work where you need to observe how your changes are accepted from the search engines. It is a process which is running for a few months and maybe less than one hour work per month:

11:12pm Dalbaq Singh:

Yes I am happy but I only have it for 25 seats !

Is he trying to sell a SEO process over the phone? Does he really think that he can get in contact with someone, which gives him the access to his homepage to make some search engine optimization? The most of the companies have hired somebody who made their homepage. As I'm really not offering some campaigns I replied:

11:13pm Rudolf Faix:

In this case you'll need to search for a core process. Some brokers are working longer than 8-9 months for getting a process. This broker I'll write about has been Rob O'Malley from UK. He retired already

It seems that he is ignoring everything what I'm writing. How someone would ever give him any work? He is even not able to listen or to read:

11:13pm Dalbaq Singh:

I want to expand more 75 seats !

As he does not read my messages and seems to be on drugs or drunk, I replied:

11:14pm Rudolf Faix:

I cannot keep you back if you like to trash money

He even tries it that he likes to pay for getting work. That is the genuine way for getting scammed.

11:14pm Dalbaq Singh:

I am ok to invest but if only the person is genuine !

Each scammer would interpret the above message as he has found a new victim. As I'm even not enjoy to scam a scammer I replied:

11:15pm Rudolf Faix:

If you invest into a campaign from a broker you'll get scammed

Even this warning he is ignoring and continues like he likes to get really scammed:

11:15pm Dalbaq Singh

Come'on Rudolf ! I know you can help me !

Please help me to get a genuine Process !

As the chat is getting boring me already I'm trying to tell it to him more directly:

11:16pm Rudolf Faix:

OK, I'll invent now a campaign only for you for the reason that you'll stop.

As you cannot accept the truth you are on the best way to get scammed

Even this message does not stop him and he continues:

11:16pm Dalbaq Singh:

I didn't understand really !

You were in this industry and you know that we can get genuine processes !

He still tries to show me that he knows more about my life than I know about it by myself. He seems to be stupid too, that he tries to continue it on this way. Why I shall tell him about my contacts? If he contacts them on the same way I'll lose some friends. For this reason I replied:

11:18pm Rudolf Faix:

As I have not one contact offering real campaigns I cannot give you some information about campaigns. On this kind of campaigns you are working I have never been working

Maybe he got it now?

11:18pm Dalbaq Singh:

So what was your area of expertise !

Wow, it seems he got it that I'm not offering some campaigns. For this reason I listed him some points about my work I have done:

11:20pm Rudolf Faix:

I have been working on computer networks, VoIP, security systems, data bases and call centers. But this centers have been working in another kind of campaigns like dating over the phone

The process dating over the phone has been working good in the German speaking area of Europe and is in U.S. not possible, because there are some requirements missing. He tries to get more information about it:

11:21pm Dalbaq Singh:

SO that is something like a voice process rather !

Where can I look for these types of campaings !

Now I need to explain him why this kind of campaign is in the U.S. not available:

11:22pm Rudolf Faix:

You even need not think about to copy such a campaign because premium phone numbers are in the U.S. already not available.

He shows again that he even did not read my answer. How someone can hire such a "call center owner"? He is not able to read and not able to accept some facts or instruction as get shown in the next messages:

11:22pm Dalbaq Singh:

Or can you help me with this !

I have a number already !

He ignored the word "premium" from premium phone numbers. So I replied again with the facts:

11:23pm Rudolf Faix:

That has been our own process. It is still working in the German speaking area of Europe, but not in the English speaking area of the world.

You have a number where you get paid if someone calls you?

Now he starts to lie to me. The U.S. have stopped this kind of phone numbers for the reason of too much scam by using this kind of phone numbers:

11:25pm Dalbaq Singh:

I have a friend in NY, he owns it and gets paid for that !

I try it again to explain him the kind of phone number to be sure that he get's it about what I'm writing:

11:25pm Rudolf Faix:

I have written about premium phone numbers. The caller pays a high price per call or per minute. You'll get paid for taking the call

Has he understood it now?

11:25pm Dalbaq Singh:

Rudolf i have a very good idea about all that !

I show him that he has no idea about any call center work and he does even not know about what has happened in the world:

11:26pm Rudolf Faix:

Then you only need to announce the phone number with any service and you can make money. The problem is only that such numbers got stopped already 2 or 3 years ago

That got stopped in the U.S, by law

It seems that he is now understanding that he cannot win this kind of discussion:

11:27pm Dalbaq Singh:

I want to rather get a process outsourced to my centre than creating or copying any process !

For this I tried to explain him:

11:28pm Rudolf Faix:

There are no processes which are getting outsourced. All offers from the low wage countries are nothing else than scam

With his next message he is confirming that he is stupid and evven cannot differ between a site of a call center and a broker:

11:28pm Dalbaq Singh:

I thought you have a website which says that you get processes outsourced to centres !

As the site is nothing else than a description of services of a call center and he seems not be able to understand English, I wrote:

11:28pm Rudolf Faix:

Not one company is searching abroad for a broker or consultant

I have nowhere any offers for call centers

It seems that he even ignore this message and continues:

11:29pm Dalbaq Singh:

But if we get a process outsourced in US !

http://wwpa.com/page/inbound-call-center-services

The content from this site is only a description about inbound call center services. It is from the time as inbound calls could get outsourced. I don't have any outsourcing offers there. So this guy has really a problem with the English language. How he can get any client if he is not able to understand anything?

11:29pm Rudolf Faix:

The only service I give to centers is free of charge, That is that I'm listing the scams

That has been an offer to get clients for my center at the Philippines. This center is already shut down

11:31 Dalbaq Singh:

SO why the website still active ?

It looks that he even thinks that a call center is giving him her campaign only to makre him happy. Does it not show how stupid he is? As it is my problem what I'm doing with my website I replied:

11:31pm Rudolf Faix:

Because I did not remove it until now. I don't know with what I shall replace it

As no requests are coming from it, it does not matter if the website is up or not

It seems that he accepts this explaination. So he likes to know now something new:

11:32pm Dalbaq Singh:

You said that you list scam companies !

so how do you differentiate between genuine and fraud companies !

As it is really easy to identify scam campaigns I have descroibed it in a simple sentence:

11:34pm Rudolf Faix

I'm reading the offer from the scammer and compare it with the law in the country of the client. The most scams are getting identified by these facts

you can read about the reasons at each scammer I have listed in my blog

It seems that he even does not believe it that he needs to use for this purpose his brain. For this he asks again:

11:36pm Dalbaq Singh:

How do you differentiate genuine vioce processes from fraud ones !

I know that a scammer is too lazy to use his brain. For this I replied again:

11:36pm Rudolf Faix

If you read my last message then you'll know it

I'm reading the offer from the scammer and compare it with the law in the country of the client. The most scams are getting identified by these facts

Now he tries to bring it to the technical support offers:

11:38pm Dalbaq Singh:

How do you know that if someone offering an inbound technical support campaign is fraud or not !

My reply is very simple:

11:42pm Rudolf Faix:

Technical support is in general a scam. Technical support gets paid from the vendor and not from the caller

11:43pm Dalbaq Singh:

yes that is what i meant !

It seems that he even does not understand how the technical support calls are getting offered at the social networks. For this I'm explaining it for im more detailed:

11:43pm Rudolf Faix:

Calls to Microsoft, Symantec, etc, are free of charge, The caller even not need to pay for the phone minutes

Now he tries it with the method "I know someone, which .....". Please remember from the begin of the conversation that he has been searching for campaigns:

11:44pm Dalbaq Singh:

I know someone who is offering an inbound technical support process and is paid by the vendor and not the caller !

The vendor would be paying to the centre and there are no sales required !

As he does not get it that he is contradicting himself already I replied:

11:45pm Rudolf Faix:

Then try to get calls from the same source

11:46pm Dalbaq Singh:

Yes I have spoken to them and even checked with other centres who are already running those processes !

taken from them

But they do charge a fee ! And gives valid legal papers against them !

So i don't find any point to see any fraud in them !

If there are already legal papers existing against them what can it be other than fraud or scam?

11:51pm Rudolf Faix:

The fee is already the fraud.

The centers you have spoken get paid for giving you the correct answer

We have in German a proverb "Wem nicht zu raten ist, dem ist nicht zu helfen" translated "This one which cannot get counseled cannot get helped":

11:51pm Dalbaq Singh:

But 3 centres are already paid and have got a the process running for the past 6 months !

I have visited 2 centres on my own and have seen the work going on !!!!!!!!!!!!!

As he tries to convince me about the legality of the campaign I'm suggesting him like everybody else would do:

11:51pm Rudolf Faix:

If you know the vendor you only need to show that your agents are certified technicians and make a them an offer which is a little bit better than your competitors. If you are lucky you'll get hired from the vendor

In the next message we can see that the vendor seems to be stupid too:

11:53pm Dalbaq Singh

The vendor has an exclusive contract with the consultant !!!!!!!!!!!

Maybe the vendor made even an exclusive contract with an broker from India. That would be the crown of the scam.

11:54 Rudolf Faix:

Not one vendor from the U.S. makes any exclusive contract.

Not one vendor from the U.S. is searching for consultant abroad

Oh, it comes better, the scammer is searching for a campaign from India abroad - in this case his search will not have some success:

11:55 Dalbaq Singh:

But when did I mention US !

Rudolf I never mentioned US vendor, DID I ????

What does he like really from me. I'm Austrian citizen and living at the Philippines. So let us continue the game:

11.56 Rudolf Faix:

There are only small software companies available in Europe. This kind of companies from Europe have not more than 3 seats for their tech support hotline

The same is valid for Australia.

The hotline from Microsoft has a head count from less than 50!!! So why you lie me?

Now he has no other possibility as to say that the client is from India:

11:58pm Dalbaq Singh:

I was taking about an Indian Client, Rudolf !

My reply has been already waiting to get entered before he has written this message:

11:59 Rudolf Faix:

Ok now I understand. Indian software companies need to have more technical support than Microsoft because their products are so bad

He tries to make now the best out of the situation he brought himself. For this he tries even to use the name of a famous person:

12:00am Dalbaq Singh:

I said that recently I heard from a centre and then got the reference about this consultant !

We are taking about e-commerce companies here !

The CEO of Microsoft is also an Indian NOW !!!!!!!!

Even a CEO of Microsoft has to follow the instructions what he gets from the owner. And this CEO did not make Microsoft to the company which is it now. There are even better examples about famous people from India available:

12:01am Rudolf Faix:

As the CEO from Microsoft has an Indian source or not does not make anything. Ghandi has been from India too

I have taken Ghandi only as an better example. His reaction shows only what he likes in reality from me:

12:02am Dalbaq Singh:

SO, what do you mean to say !

12:02am Rudolf Faix:

That does not make anybody better or worse

12:03am Dalbaq Singh:

I did not make anybody worse rather you said that indian softwares are bad !

And what do you know about ghandi ????

12:04am Rudolf Faix

It does not make India better or worse if one has a good job. There are a lot of good people available on the world

12:04 Dalbaq Singh

I asked for your suggestion and you went on a wrong line rather !

12:05am Rudolf Faix:

Buddha has its source in India too

It seems that this answer has satisfied him and he is changing the topic back to the beginning:

12:05am Dalbaq Singh:

I just asked how can someone identify if there is something fishy in these offeres !

He still does not believe it that the most of the scammers are getting identified by their own scam offers. I repeated it for him again:

12:05am Rudolf Faix:

And I have given you an answer

Did you not read it until now?

12:06am Dalbaq Singh:

Because i did not find any point which shows that there is something wrong !

As the "And gives valid legal papers against them" and the fee for the work are not already enough proof for the scam, he tries even to change the countries and the conditions how he likes. He likes to have from me a statement, which I cannot give to him as he is not declaring all the facts before. It seems to be that he tries to learn how to scam better. For the purpose to teach scammers I'm not available.

12:07am Rudolf Faix

I had written about how to identify scammer: I'm reading the offer from the scammer and compare it with the law in the country of the client. The most scams are getting identified by these facts

If you take a look at the scam campaigns that are listed on my site then you'll see that all these campaigns have a client in the English speaking countries. You have started about an Indian company which operates in India, So you need to know if they are operating against the law in India, I even cannot read and understand the Indian law.

Update Jan. 18, 2017:
Link from Dalbaq Singh (https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100010758575096) removed as it returns error 404 - not found.

 

The Marketing Source - Robbie Middleton - sent a bad joke instead of a proof

In each of the articles about the Caribbean Cruise Line (CCL) – Virtual Voice Technology (VVT) is getting found that the center is guilty by themselves if they are accepting the conditions from The Marketing Source. Business is a risk and not a sandpit where nothing can happen. Even in the email from Robbie Middleton is stated gets found that this campaign “is a VERY tough campaign with tight margins”.

The campaign gets offered as none voice campaign where the agent does not need to speak. That is nothing else than a misleading promotion, because if we take a look at the article “FTC Statement Virtual Voice Technology - CallAssistant, L.C. - submitted by The Marketing Source - Vance Vogel” then we can read that the agent is free in his choice to speak or playing prerecorded messages. The background of the FTC-rule is that it has to be a life agent to be available that the live agent has to speak with the called one if a recording is not available for answering a specific question. It will be seldom happen, but it can happen.

The statement that only Lars is offering the CCL campaign is not correct. Robbie Middleton has simple forgotten that he is offering the campaign at BPO Friends by himself too. Everybody can be sure that other companies have voice systems too, which are conform to the FTC rules.  TMS is not the only company, which has access to such a system. It is only used as an argument for their rip-off. US$ 200/week system costs + VoIP (up to $ 275) for 12 seats (24 connections) are nothing else than profiteering.

We have built for an Austrian satellite TV broadcaster a similar system with click to dial, manual selection of prerecordings and a few more features like play and win, live quiz, dating, shopping, etc. in a multi-language system (German, English, French, Spanish, Polnish), for € 1,450 (~US$ 1,615) including server hardware. This system has assigned 2,200 phone numbers, on this system are working 250 agents and a few full automated services like every 50th caller goes live into the studio, each 100th caller is winning a price, etc. at the same time.

It is not forbidden to make a bad deal. Everybody, who accepting a bad deal, is guilty by himself if he lose money in such a case. It is only from a company expected to recognize a good and a bad deal. If a company defends such a bad deal then such a company is in my opinion very suspect and there seems to be a reason why they are defending such a bad deal. Mostly is the reason that they are earning by themselves.

The construction of the included proof from the email shows more that it is a fake instead of a proof.  I think that CCL and TMS have enough experience in front of the law court collected to know how a proof has to look like. In this case the proof consists of pictures (one company header, and one picture for each “invoice” line), which seems to be from different sources. Such a construction is nowhere accepted as a proof for anything. All necessary parts for an official invoice are missing. It seems even to be a secret to whom the invoice got sent.

In a fair and transparent business is it usage that as soon as a customer likes to use his own or rented systems has the customer to pay the bill for it. How the customer makes his calculation in this case is the problem of the customer and not the problem of the service provider. Already the promotion of the campaign is misleading because there is written “The base rate is $ 2.25 per transfer with additional performance incentives based on quality” (BPO Friends - Robbie Middleton, .pdf (187.38 kb)). In such a case the rate cannot be lower than $ 2.25 for the >60 seconds transfer, but if we take a look at the document VVT CPD Explanation.docx (17.84 kb) we see that the base rate can be lower too.

The email from Robbie Middleton in reaction to my article "Slavery offer: CCL VVT none Voice or Semi-Voice campaign - The Marketing Source - Vance Vogel":

On Fri, Sep 4, 2015 at 6:05 PM, Robbie Middleton <rmiddleton@themarketingsource.com> wrote:

Rudolph,

What your source neglected to tell you is that there is a list of requirements VVT sends centers at the time of campaign implementation and VVT makes NO claims that this is an easy campaign at any time.  VVT does not even recruit centers at all.  Every center VVt have has either approached VVT via word of mouth or through Lars.  Lars is the ONLY approved broker for the VVT campaign.  VVT actually tell the centers that this is a VERY tough campaign with tight margins and very clearly state all charges.  99% of all center that fail, do so because they do not follow our guidelines.  It is absolutely, positively cheaper and easier to dial using the centers own VOIP and dialer, unfortunately this is ILLEGAL per the TCPA laws as well as infractions of the Telemarketing Sales Rule that would undoubtedly occur if the call centers were not regulated.    TMS and/or VVT receives no profit Login and VOIP charges.  I have copied the most recent invoice for logins associated with 4 centers Lars has referred and feel free to confirm the same with the company that invoices us as well as Lars.  This is the actual amount deducted from the centers commissions and not a penny more.  You can see that VVT IS CHARGED $10/login.  VVT pre-pays this expense on behalf of the centers so they do not have any up-front expense of their own.  VVT provides Leads, VOIP and Logins so they can LAUNCH without investing ANY of their own money.    VVT then deducts this Login and VOIP expense from the centers earned commissions.  There is no charge for leads.  We disperse the amount VVT loads each for VOIP each week evenly amongst all centers based on their percentage of total logins.  We do not profit from this expense either.  Regarding “CPD” and what your source failed to tell you is that VVT is paid by the cruise line on a CPD (Cost Per Deal) basis.  Each centers quality is tracked separately and a quantitative measure of quality is attached to their transfers in terms of “CPD”.  We cannot let centers send calls “at will” with no concern for quality as many of them (even with the CPD +/- structure in place) send calls with no customer on the line, transfer answering machines, transfer customers that requested DNC, etc….. I will send you the complete VVT launch e-mail just as I would a prospective center so you can see the truth.  The fact that VVT must implement so many rules and guidelines is indeed most unfortunate, but don’t let your source fool you into thinking we are “screwing” them.  Rules and guidelines are in place to adhere to all applicable laws and to protect VVT from unethical centers.  We have centers that have been doing the campaign for more than 3 years now and while it isn’t easy, it CAN be profitable when guidelines are adhered to. 

The above email had the following five pictures included as shown belown: 

Invoice header of SunBridge Systems
One line of the invoice from Sunbridge Systems
Another line of the invoice from Sunbridge Systems
Another line of the invoice from Sunbridge Systems
Another line of the invoice from Sunbridge Systems

The invoice header seems to be a fake because I did not find until now one IT company frome the U.S.

  • where the office phone number is hidden for privacy reasons from the public phone directory

  • where the office phone number is assigned to Google voice

  • where tel2name.com gives the result: 727-753-9323 - Deane Arteaga Wisteria Cir New Port Richey, Florida instead of Sun Bridge Systems LLC.

  • which writes their own domain name in the heaer of the invoice wrong
    (subbridgesystems.com instead of sunbridgesystems.com)

  • which needs to hide the ownership of their domain behind a privacy service

  • which makes since 2 years and 5 months promotions at her homepage for their registrar Godaddy

  • which has since 2 years and 5 months a homepage with the amazing content
    Screenshot from the homepage of sunbridgesystems.com

  • Buzzfile.com says about SUN BRIDGE SYSTEMS LLC:
    Sun Bridge Systems is located in Oldsmar, Florida. This organization primarily operates in the Business Services, nec business / industry within the Business Services sector. This organization has been operating for approximately 2 years. Sun Bridge Systems is estimated to generate $ 49,000 in annual revenues, and employs approximately 1 people at this single location.

SUN BRIDGE SYSTEMS, LLC is really a company and is listed at Floridas Department of State Division of Corporations (.pdf (119.20 kb)). The company got founded on March 11, 2013 at 5520 Rio Vista Dr., Clearwater, FL. 33760 (Link, .pdf (43.19 kb)) and relocated on April 1, 2014 to 518 Lakewood Dr., Oldsmar, FL 34677 (Link, .pdf (3.30 kb)).

Interesting is that LookUpBear (.pdf (118.69 kb)) tell us that the company SUN BRIDGE SYSTEMS, LLC is listed "under the heading Construction/Contractors which includes businesses that may offer home improvement construction, home construction, roofers, manufacturing of building materials". I know that we all would search for a telcommunications company in exactly this category!

Screenshot from the entry Sun Bridge Systems, LLC from LookUpBear

Update Jan. 18, 2017: Link to http://bpofriends.com/profiles/blogs/vvt-free-cruise-non-voice-process removed as it already returns error 404 - not found.

Meldy Brett - a typical Facebook dating scammer

A few years ago, I have been hunting for dating scammer. By this I got in contact with a girl from the Philippines. Her name as been at this time Meldy Canonigo. She has been in a very bad (proved) situation and I decided to help her a little bit.
 
Around 2 years ago I got the call for help from at one of the platforms, where a Philippina with the name Wilma - living in Austria run into troubles after her husband died by an accident. She did not speak German and did not know the steps which should be done at the government offices. She even could not know it, because they have been only married for less than 6 months. A few months they have been living at the Philippines. At this time I stopped my scammer war and helped her personally. Make the paperwork for her and supported her in getting her heritage. At this time I deleted my Facebook account too.
 
Last Sunday I got a message from the woman I helped before. Her name changed already from Cononigo to Brett. Read it by yourself:
 
As I'm living in a relationship I have only chatted without any personal interests with Meldy Brett. As she tried to keep me busy the whole day by chatting, I have been looking at her Facebook profile. You find a printout of her profile in the attached pdf document, If you take a look at her profile you'll see some comments of her actual husband Don Brett. During she has been eating by chatting with me, I liked his messages, You see it in the following chat protocoll:
 
 
Seen Thu 6:38am
 
 
That is the end of the chat. She even did not try to get in contact with me any more.
 
Why do I classify this as scam?
Very simple, if she has really only interest in being friend with me, which got lost 2 years ago, than it would not be any problem if she is married, has a boy friend or living in another relationship. I have a girl friend and living with her in a relationship too. Why we should avoid to have some friends?
 
I think that she likes to have more support and have been searching for victims at Facebook. I had deleted my Facebook account during the time I helped Wilma, the stranded Philippina in Austria. I made a new Facebook account during the year 2014.
 
I think that she only got it from my help, that it is easier to get money by scamming others than by doing some work, That can be the negative site if you are helping someone,
 
As you never know before how they people will develop their own personality with the time, I'll continue helping others. I'll be happy if someone says thank you and will forward the help he received to others when ever it is possible for him. This can make the world a little bit better.
 

Meldy Brett.pdf (12.88 mb)